Opening a fish store

So, I have been toying with the idea for a while now. My Dad and I always wanted to open a fish store in NY, but never did. I have been doing a lot of thinking about it and may just start seriously planning this. My idea is an African Cichlid specific store. "Jewel of the Rift" is the working title for now.

What I want from you guys is ideas on what you want in a fish store. What would you like to see? What would sway you to a store even if it was out of your way?

Post up your thoughts and I will post up what I have in mind.

Thanks!

200 gal. NEON TETRA TANK.

Well ventillated though

i say a store that would sway me is veriety, clean, and doin it right, dontt cramp fish, or no one will go. sure put a jack dempsey in a 20 gallon, but only if its small...... just dont put full grown fish in tanks to small for them. i understand that you would have to have fish that grow to be big in small tanks because you dont plan on having them for a long time.

ALSO, have a couple displays, show them what you can do... have maybe a small tropical fish section, like tetras, angels, plecos, and cories or sumthing. and make sure you have tanks for plants!

IMO i wouldnt run it on one filter because of sickness, i would get a huge shipment for some cheap canisters or run like 4 tanks per filter.

i dont wanna see dead fish in tanks, so when you get it set up take a walk around the whole store looking at every tank every hour or so.

lars on wrote:200 gal. NEON TETRA TANK.

Well ventillated though

yer fired.

dont limit yourself to freshwater or at least just keep a few salt water items on hand just the basics

not looking for basic. In fact, I will have a "no dumbass" rule in place. No salt water, this is a specialty store.

dang it im not allowed in then.....

teddyzaper wrote:dang it im not allowed in then.....

Pretty much why I am doing it..lol.

Like last night, refuse service to people who dont have adequate tanks

buy fish from local breeders also, breed your own fish

lars on wrote:Like last night, refuse service to people who dont have adequate tanks

xactly.

well the problem with refusing is that its really opinion. if your doing saltwater and someone wants to buy a mandarin dragonet, there are huge debates on minimum size, between 25 gallons and 150 gallons. although i would say 50 gallons is minimum, someone may say differently. this is just the best example i could think of, so just think of it as a cichlid of some sort. also, if you tell them it wont work in thier tank, show them other options, dont just tell them no then walk off.

also, have a breeding set up in the back, and make it presentable, a lot of people love that stuff and also, you can have them put thier name down for the certain brood. show the parents to and DONT sell the parents...

write on the glass with wax or sumthing like that. you will be getting different fish and different shipments so no stickers. i hate it when i cant find what im trying to buy because all the tanks are mislabeled. just update it when you get new inventory and when you bad something just cross out the name, if there are some left leave it.

In what state would you open this fish store??

... here...

My idea is a clean, ultra modern store, a complet submersion experience. A place you would like to hang out in, even if just to look at everything. There will be a coffee bar/lounge area. There will be cool lighting, interactive kiosks that answer questions you may have about certain fish. Big screen TV's on the wall showing cool African Cichlid related documentaries. A super knowledgeable staff that knows how to treat a customer. Low prices and high volume are key in a venture like this. I am going to be starting a market saturation survey Monday to ascertain a suitable location.

make sure you have a lot of dry goods. even add in skimmers, i know its not freshwater but even though you may not have saltwater fish its still nice to have an LFS that has them. also with low prices comes low quality OR low income. you can chose. also, i would offer the coffee free. have a computer that someone can go on and search the fish they want to buy. dont have expensive lights on top of fish only tanks, just enough to see the colors nicely, add a lot of LED's, they make the color of the fish pop!

Teddy, while I appreciate your input, I have owned several extremely successful businesses, from a night club in NY to a detailing shop in Florida. I am well aware of business practices and customer service.

i dont doubt it, and im not telling you your wrong or right (although your right )... i just want to put it out there for others, and if you didnt know, or dont remember. im sure this store will be amazing, i just want you to get it right the first time! also, i like to add little tips on stuff that my crazy mind thinks up

There will be a few key things in this store. One will be the display tanks. I am thinking 500 gallon tanks, all lake specific biopes. Malawi, Victoria and Tanganyika. I will not be delving into riverine, but it is a possibility later on. As for low cost = low quality, that is not necessarily true. Acquisition pricing vs quantitative pricing dictates lower prices for the same merchandise at higher quantities. So, that being said, you can get the same filter for much less if you buy more. You then pass the savings on to the customer..and the cycle continues.

true that! i think a few 500 tanks would be a bit overwhelming for me, i would be more interested in 100-200 gallons because that is actualy possible in a house withough pouring a seperate foundation. also, im sure you already thought of this, but have at least 1 tank of every size for sale, and have some pre thought up set ups or offer a set up that they can chose from stuff in the store for a set price.

I do like Teddy's idea on the breeding area. I really want to grow my own stock. That would be another key feature of the store. Making it presentable is a must. I am into very neat, well organized spaces. This store will be a study in working smarter, not harder.

lol, i so gotta work there, the store would be spotless with my major OCD. although i would be bugging you 24-7 about a saltwater section, i bet youd let me set up a 10 gallon >.> LOL

Tanks will abound. I want my display tanks to be overwhelming, that's the idea. My stocking tanks will be bigger than most, but uniform. I HATE seeing a store with 100 different size stock tanks. I'm just trying to decide on tank size. Filtration is going to be another issue to tackle. Right now, I am thinking a FPT (filter per tank) setup with mostly sponge filters in the stocking tanks...but heating is another issue. The electric bill is going to be AMAZING! lol

get a room heater, it will be nice and toasty you could cook eggs on the floor

I'll be working on a floor plan here shortly to get a good feel for the layout.
One idea I have is the front windows of the store. Ever seen a window that looked like an aquarium? Think about that. viewable from inside and out, like you were walking through the Seattle Aquarium.

Better be some plexi glass that aint breakable, I see horrible things happening at night to those windows, and lots of cichlids on the floor

amke sure its thick glass!!!!! dont want any punks trying to break it.

2" thick acrylic. We will have roll up doors..not to worry.

oh by the way, if you send me the layout, i can make it on google sketch up with a walkthrough for you, for a cheap price of course

I have an architectural firm in Florida working on it..some friends of mine doing it for free.

poo...

teddyzaper wrote:true that! i think a few 500 tanks would be a bit overwhelming for me, i would be more interested in 100-200 gallons because that is actualy possible in a house withough pouring a seperate foundation. also, im sure you already thought of this, but have at least 1 tank of every size for sale, and have some pre thought up set ups or offer a set up that they can chose from stuff in the store for a set price.

LOL- really? Every LFS has a 100-200 gallon display tank! 500+ is what i'm talkin' about! He wants to set himself apart from everyone else, that's the whole idea I am getting from his plan. Although I don't know why you would waste a huge tank like that on just cichlids, but of course that is just my opinion. Good luck if you follow through with the store!

I'm taking what I like and making a business out of it. The huge display tanks will be awesome. This will be a different kind of store.

just make sure you have beginer fish! obvious but ive seen some stores that are just advanced.

I really hope you can eventually get this thing rolling. It's always been my dream as well. Good luck with your venture, and keep everyone updated

Mikey, if all goes as planned, I will have a location in a year. Then 6 months of building and a grand opening 18 months from now.

Mikey wrote:I really hope you can eventually get this thing rolling. It's always been my dream as well. Good luck with your venture, and keep everyone updated

Yeah someday I would love to open a fish store as well. Wish one of my parents would pay to get it started

Do inverts to. (: clams, crayfish,crabsAnd a plant section! A small tank atleast, for the vegetarian cichlids and jus plain tank decor

nothing is set in stone yet..lots of planning left to do

Hey Spyral,

Very exciting! One thing that I think would go over really well with the community you're talking about serving is selling a stock of F1. Since we mostly have to mail order these today I would imagine there's some room for someone willing to go bigger on their orders and take advantage of wholesale rates. Another thing - if you could build a network of local breeders that would really help keep your inventory costs down.

I look forward to seeing how this idea shapes up over the coming months - keep us updated!

I'd advise you to setup shop in your basement first, and learn how to maintan, 50 aquariums, all that is learned there can be transfered to the business.

First of all, decide where your fish are coming from. There are 3 wholesalers, 2 in washington, 1 in oregon. Then there is out of state, which means you'll want to be located near seatac.

Also, 50% of your sales will be guppies, tetras etc. Don't get me wrong, you'll have lots of cichlid patrons as well. However you will net more profet from common fish than the cichlid die hards.

Next I advise you to not carry many dry goods. As wholesale prices vs internet pricing is difficult at best. Your competitors are dr fosters, big als etc. Get wholesale price list, then compare it to online, and realize they're oporating without a storefront overhead, and run at only a %20 markup over list cost.

A local fish store should focus on what is rather bought in person than online. Fish, tanks, emergency meds etc. Food, lighting, filters, etc, will be bought online for the most part, still have some of those on hand, cause some people will want to support you. However people also like to save their dollars where they can.

In my experience, the most important thing to a store is, fish health, and fish knowledge. People are willing to pay extra for a fish that is healthy, and someone who can advise them and help them from making a mistake when setting up a tank.

Pick your niche and stay with it, don't be a jack of all trades. You'll just get down rated by customers. You'll have to staff an expert saltwater person every hour you're open, or you'll get a rep as bad as petco for advise etc. Same thing goes for your cichlids, you can't have someone who can keep fish, but can't show the difference between your victorian cichlids. Anyone can show some people peacocks, mbunas etc. Victorians make employees head spin, and honestly they probably don't care enough to learn them.

Don't focus on being the cheapest price, there is always someone out there that will undercut you. Focus on offering the best knowledge. Time is money, if you can provide someone with correct knowledge the first time, they will value that, over saving $2 on a fish, but having compatibility problems.

There are many aspects to this business, that you've never realized will come into play, until you've been in the business. For instance, finding a tax accountant, that specializes in livestock, so that you can claim your losses on your taxes etc.

As for aquariums as the storefront. The reason it isnt done, is it makes it much harder to control your store temperature. Not to mention those display tank's temperature. On days like today, you'd be losing fish, or having your roll doors down. Giving the impression you're closed. In Washington, you don't need to glitz and glam of the north east where good fish shops are a dime a dozen, all you need is a honest trade, with knowledge to back it.

"In Washington You don't need glitz and glam like in the North East"

To say that people in Washington would not like something different and interactive is a bit ignorant, don't you think?

Thanks for your input.

To throw in my few words of wisdom... and I mean very few, I'm hardly a fish store expert lol

I'd suggest against an on site breeding location unless you have an extremely large size store, you'll end up losing alot of floor space to fish that might not be producing alot for you (what with conditioning, raising fry and general fickle fish... sure the conditions might be right but what's to say that means they'll breed?)
I'd go with something more along the lines of wet spot/cichlid exchange... store front that looks great, lots of displays and knowledgeable people, but keep the dirty workings (the breeding setup is likely to take alot of your time) to a seperate facility, close by if possible so if somebody absolutely has to see the parents or wants to buy alot of some sort of fish.. you can simply go over there. When it comes to breeding fish alot of what I've seen is that is isn't how the tanks look that matters, it's how they're maintained. You won't have much time to spend making the tanks look pretty.
Trust me, I work about 20 hours a week and don't have much time to scrub algae or clean tank fronts, I'm spending most of my time helping customers or doing water changes to keep the tanks alive. And I'm only in charge of less than a hundred tanks, you're likely to have alot more. I also spend alot of free time in the store finishing what I didn't get done before.

Not to undercut the wholesalers but I'd suggest you get the larger quantity of your startup fish from either florida farms where their quality seems a bit higher or directly from importers, alot of rift lake cichlids I've seen from wholesalers have been... eh, subpar. This way you can get breeder stock cheaper and easier than having to raise your own from the 1-2 inch juvies available through wholesalers.

Gotta agree with cory on the fact that you can't just have cichlid experts, while your larger stock and clientel will be there for the cichlids, alot of people don't just stick to one thing... take Sandnuka for instance, he's got a ton of types of tropheus but he also does planted discus, so having employees that know about other topics is a bonus.
Another thing to keep in mind is that your employees will be surrounded by african cichlids and pick up on africans faster than the other subjects, so hiring employees with experience and expertice in other areas (planted, saltwater, community, SA/CA, etc.) would probably be smarter than hiring, say... Ad Konings (a bit far fetched but I hope the idea gets across)

A bit of what I want to see at your store, a larger stock of the schooling cichlids and the featherfins... I've wanted some paracyps forever but nowhere carries them, and when they have cyps they're never at a reasonable size.

PS... if you ever need a hand I'd be happy to help out at your store, even if it's just mopping floors or scrubbing tanks

I already hired Ad Konings, he'll be working the espresso bar.

Great ideas guys, keep 'em coming!

Awesome, I've heard he makes a killer quad mocha...

We'll see. If he can't, he's out on his ass.

Spyral wrote:"In Washington You don't need glitz and glam like in the North East"

To say that people in Washington would not like something different and interactive is a bit ignorant, don't you think?

Thanks for your input.

There's a difference in what I said, and what you're thinking. I said you don't need the glitz and glam of the north east to be successful. I'm sure people would appreciate it. I have no doubt, people would enjoy the aquarium fish super store, with burrito bar, espresso lounge, animal hospital, and dolphin dive.

The research on how many of those burrito buyers will buy a frontosa, or how many espresso lounge people will buy their first 10 gallon tank has yet to be seen.

Cross marketing is a complex thing, I have no doubt you'd attract people who would not normally frequent your store. However, that doesn't mean they'll actually buy anything. Lots of people love to take their kids to the "free zoo" spend 45 minutes in the store, generally causing mayhem. Moving fish tags, sticking their hands in aquariums etc.

I guess I'd equate the one stop aquarium shop, to a tank with 10 canister filters. Sure it's better. But after 3, each one after is redundant.

I can't imagine the management nightmares of an aquarium shop mixed with anything. You have to hire fish people, and baristas. You have to explain why your baristas get tipped $2 on a 6 dollar coffee, and your fish guy gets only his wage, on a $200 fish sale. You yourself, have to manage the spoilable goods on the espresso side, and the stock lists of fish. While dealing with an espresso that was made incorrectly, and customer #2's dead platy, that doesnt understand what an ammonia spike is.

Every store has their lure:
The fish store- coupons, every month, bribe them in.
A place for pets - discounts on tuesdays, cichlids, kevin's knowledge.
Conway - cichlid specialty, knowledge, personal service.
Petsmart- location, you cant drive 20 minutes without passing one.
Pet pourii - rare fish.
Chinatown stores - crazy cheap prices.
Aquarist world - Big show tanks, caters to larger fish
Bridges - Nice presentation, reptile kids room.
Clarks feed and seed - planted tanks/plant selection.

Rift Lake Cichlids- Espresso bar, Show tanks, Cichlid specialty.

I would visit your store for the cichlids, and the show tanks once. Show tanks I only need to see once, it's a decent bonus to check in on them again, when i go back.. But like the wetspot's fire eel tank. I dont have the feeling that I'm missing out by not going to see it this weekend. Also, I'm likely to go out to lunch before going fish shopping with buddies. There is a slight chance I would purchase a drink on the way out of your store.

Now, if your cichlids, wernt up to par, it would negate the other two aspects. In all reality, I end up going to 3-5 stores, when I go fish shopping. What guides my travel, is how likely I am to find a fish I'd like to purchase. If I strike out 10 times in a row, you fall pretty far down on the list, maybe check back in 3 months.

If I was you, i'd try to find some feasibility studies on aquariums in las vegas. Lots of places have them. When I was there a month ago, no one was huddled around even looking at them, and these were 10000 gallon tanks in bars, restaurants etc.

I think Jacko explained a fish store perfectly. There are lots of "that would be neat" ideas, that come up in the shop every single day. At the end of the day, you needed 2 more hours to get the manditory stuff done, and the fun neat idea stuff, time is never available for. As you've run businesses before, you know employee wage cost, will make or break your business. If there is time for people to sit around and setup stuff for fun, the bills will eventually go unpaid.

A good general rule for you, it costs a store 25 cents a gallon, each month to maintain itself. So one 10 gallon tanks costs you $2.50 a month , to rent the space, heat it, clean it, and have an employee there to sell out of it. This number doesn't really change whether you have 10 aquariums or 5000. Because the maintenance and employee ratio to take care of tanks remains the same.

Jesus Cory, what's with you and your logic? Dream crusher!

(Generally I avoid all post over 3 paragraphs like the plague. But Cory some how tricked me!)

In the end, I have the money to do whatever I want and that is pretty much what I am going to do..lol.

Spyral wrote:In the end, I have the money to do whatever I want and that is pretty much what I am going to do..lol.

LOL! That's the New York Yankee spirit!

Can't f*** with a dirty New Yorker..lol