Substrate, SAND!

ok, soooooo I was thinking of changing substrate in my newly found tank from the usually gravel/crushed coral.. to sand! then i looked at the price! WOWZERS! especially if you want a colored sand, like black.

So, because we washingtonians live next to the beach, can I just drive down to the beach... like oceans shores... fill up a bucket of sand, and dump it in my tank??? does fresh sand from our beaches mess with the water chem??? cause I got my PH for my african cichlids perfect right now, and I dont want to throw anything off.. Anybody ever try it??? Who is using sand for there african cichlids???? How do you like it??? is cleaning it hard??? probably doesnt vacume like gravel does....

My brother just went to home depot and got a big bag of cheap kids play sand..... it works, and looks alright. I think our beach sand on the shores looks better... wish i had enough money to buy moonsand black though, thats my favorite!

I wouldn't do it. Sand is basically ground up rock, and if it's from the ocean then it's gonna be really salty. I would also be concerned about any parasites or illnesses living on it. Most companies make "synthetic" sand or use sand from a controlled body of water so you know it's tank safe. Look for bulk sand if you can; it's much cheaper. I'd rather pay the price for safe sand than using sand I wasn't sure about

"grout" sand works great but you must rinse it very very very very very very well, and i mean that, comes with tons of small particles that cloud the water like a wet dust storm but after a very good rinse its nice, natural looking, and the cichlids will run it through their gills(keepin em both clean!)

any clean sand in bags from lowes will work, rinse well. I got 100lbs of white for $8, then mixed in crushed coral . the fish love sucking up the sand

dude just get the moon sand it looks way better and it worth the price...thats what i use in my tank
you wont be happy unless you get it lol

sidekicking wrote:dude just get the moon sand it looks way better and it worth the price...thats what i use in my tank
you wont be happy unless you get it lol

just lmao...moon sand

you might find some colored pool filter sand from a pool store sometimes they carry it and its usually cheaper than the lfs price, you can get white silica from home depot 100# for $8. i my self have black, white and what they call an oatmeal sand i prefer the look of the oatmeal sand the best but the white is a close second i think the white brings out there colors better as it feels like it holds the light in the tank better for a brighter richer feel

your tanks posted on here icer? bet they look badass

haven't had time to take good pictures of my best ones ill try and get some soon, trying to set up a 125 to condense my smaller ones, gotta make a divider yet gotta keep the big fish apart from the little fishes

hey Icer, im gonna bring the snails to you tomorrow at like 9:00am. Want the $10 tank with light too?? and if i stop by your place id love to see your tanks....

sounds good and yes to the tank ill pm you later with the add. from what i remember is on your way hopefully i can keep my munchkins from destroying the place lol

So, how much sand do I add to a 80gal tank??! Anybody have a good formula for that? I used to believe a pound for every gallon, but its so hard to clean, I was think 1 pound per 2 gallons??? anybody have suggestions?

my bottom is very thin about 1/4 in the middle tapering to 1/8 near the edge

Nuka, was I not just with you when you bought sand? If you dont mind natural color go to lowes and get the 100 lbs of 100% Silica sand for 8 dollars or something around that... Forget robbing our beaches the sand the WDFW will not allow it anyways and its horrible for parasites....You can get colored pool sand and sand blasting sand as well, sand blasting sand is nice cause you can get glass sand really really clean stuff hardly needs washing.... But anyhow what happened with black sand you just bought today?

I bought white and black sand from A Place for Pets in Burien. I love the look of the white and black all mixed up and the fish LOVE to mess with it..lol. It is a lot easier (and faster) to clean than gravel because fish poop and food remains don't sink into it. Everything lays on top making it very easy to vacuum up. Just make sure not to bury your vacuum nozzle in the sand..lol. Just hover over the dirt and it sucks it right up!

lol, thats 40lbs... I wanted to see if anyone would say 40lbs for my tank without me saying thats what I had... lol, Now I spoiled that plan... I know what you thought, just finding out how many people agreed/disagreed.... I agree with us... lol. I should get one more bag... or a 20lb bag of crushed coral... but thats $$

sandnuka wrote:So, how much sand do I add to a 80gal tank??! Anybody have a good formula for that? I used to believe a pound for every gallon, but its so hard to clean, I was think 1 pound per 2 gallons??? anybody have suggestions?

It really depends on the fish you have. Africans tend to move the sand around a LOT. They love to rearrange the tank substrate. So, unless you want them to clear out spots, do about a pound per gallon or figure on 2" minimum depth of sand. I have 80 pounds in a 55 gallon and it is pretty deep, almost 3".

sandnuka wrote:lol, thats 40lbs... I wanted to see if anyone would say 40lbs for my tank without me saying thats what I had... lol, Now I spoiled that plan... I know what you thought, just finding out how many people agreed/disagreed.... I agree with us... lol. I should get one more bag... or a 20lb bag of crushed coral... but thats $$

40# in an 80gal is going to be real thin.

go buy a 100lb bag of silica sand at home depot

I have a half a bag of crushed coral left and some argonite sand I could sell you??

I use 100lb bags of silicia sand from Homedepot myself...no need to wash, just pour into the tank and fill em up with water. 100lbs is enough for my 135 gallon tank (6ft x 18" footprint)

so cheap, I have seen people selling this for as much as a dollar a pound on craigslist.

I avoid playsand as these type may take time for the dust to settle.

Just to let everyone know..... 40lbs was more than enough for my 80gal tall!!!!! waaaaaaaaay more than enough! I didnt even use all the second bag! just wanted to let you guys know

African Cichlids love to dig; even more so with sand. I wouldn't go less than the one pound per gallon. There is a reasonably easy way to clean it though. I clean about 20 pounds at a time in a 20 gallon high aquarium. I just set the aquarium in my driveway and powerspray the sand with my garden hose and nozzle. Spray till there is 3 or 4 gallons of water in the tank, moving vigorously across the sand with the solid stream of water. Then tip the tank on end slowly and drain the water. I repeat this 6 or 7 times and then transfer the sand to the tank being set up. (In a 10 or 20 gallon tank setup, I get my sand cleaned all at once this way) Of course, you will see this trail of fine sand particles flowing down my driveway... but this is the Northwest... the rain will eventually wash it away!

I have a gravel bottom in my Cichlid/Guorami tank and after reading all this, i am thinking on changing over to sand.... but.... I have a undergravel filter and was wondering do i have to change over to a external filter or is it possible to keep the filter in there with a finer mesh/screen to keep the sand out.. and if so suggestions por favor

sand wouldnt let much water flow through, i dont know if its impossible but changing filters might be a better idea none the less

I have a gravel bottom in my Cichlid/Guorami tank and after reading all this, i am thinking on changing over to sand.... but.... I have a undergravel filter and was wondering do i have to change over to a external filter or is it possible to keep the filter in there with a finer mesh/screen to keep the sand out.. and if so suggestions por favor

I've had sand with and under gravel filter before and it works just fine....just make sure to vacuum the sand often....I never had any problems and its also good to have an HOB filter just for extra filtration

You would be better off reversing the flow from the bottom to top (pushing the water from the tank-prefiltered-into the UGF plates and forcing water up into the tank) with a power head if you insist on a under 'substrate' filter and sand. As the silica from the unavoidable ingestion of sand is BAD for anything that rotates...

Besides this is a better UGF setup than the normal way because it will help avoid dead spots in the filter area.

The bad part is finding a power head that does well at reverse flow...My old UGF powerhead is about to become a foam filtered circulation pump...

Alright, anyone that shops at Sierra Renton, a place for pets, or midway pets... I found where they get their sand from. Renton mineral company. I got 200lbs of pool filter sand for 40$. If you go with the .8 grain, its bigger and doesn't get sucked up by your filters. A lot easier to rinse than silica and play sand because of the big grain. They also had about 20 different sands with all different grain sizes. This is also a sweet place to buy rocks if you're looking. They have mountains of all different types of rock. I think they said river rock was about 20$ for a ton! Lol not that you'd need that much.
Cleaning the sand isn't to bad. I bought a vinyl hose, I fill it up with tap water, cove one end with your finger, put the en thats not covered into a bucket, put the end you're covering into the tanks water, release your finger and she'll start sucking.
I do it once a week before my weekly WC's.
I don't like gravel because everything gets to the bottom of the tank an is a pain tosyphon.
Anyways, hope this helps

Good information, Will. Did the pool filter sand come in different colors? The pfs that I use now is a tan color.

I believe they had a natural and white color. They might of even had more. They broke out a small tackle box and each hole had a different sand. Some were different colors and sizes.

Will I am wrote:Alright, anyone that shops at Sierra Renton, a place for pets, or midway pets... I found where they get their sand from. Renton mineral company. I got 200lbs of pool filter sand for 40$. If you go with the .8 grain, its bigger and doesn't get sucked up by your filters. A lot easier to rinse than silica and play sand because of the big grain. They also had about 20 different sands with all different grain sizes. This is also a sweet place to buy rocks if you're looking. They have mountains of all different types of rock. I think they said river rock was about 20$ for a ton! Lol not that you'd need that much.
Cleaning the sand isn't to bad. I bought a vinyl hose, I fill it up with tap water, cove one end with your finger, put the en thats not covered into a bucket, put the end you're covering into the tanks water, release your finger and she'll start sucking.
I do it once a week before my weekly WC's.
I don't like gravel because everything gets to the bottom of the tank an is a pain tosyphon.
Anyways, hope this helps

What was the name of this company???

Renton mineral company?

This one?

Manufacturers Mineral Co
1215 Monster Road Southwest
Renton, WA 98057-2962

Ashley wrote:Renton mineral company?

^^^ ^^^

Pretty cool place. They have so many different rocks, just mountains of them. Super cheap!

I use only driftwood so rock not good for me

censeoflife wrote:This one?

Manufacturers Mineral Co
1215 Monster Road Southwest
Renton, WA 98057-2962

^^^This is the ONE!^^^

If you do go sand, I would really recommend the .8 grain size. I don't know how many threads I've read in other forums about peoples filters getting jacked because of sand. This .8 grain sand is perfect, comes in white as well.

If you live close, go check them out. Tell them you want to see their pool filter sand.

My HOB is totally getting jacked by sand lol!!

aww i was hoping they had a website hopefully i can swing by and check it out when im up there. all landscaping places ive been to that carried rock and gravel didnt carry very many things that could be used in aquariums... I mean you could they just didnt look great or were to big and such..

I use rock from the river or beach.... just boil it when I get home, and throw it in the tank... its free! and honestly, you can find some really nice pieces out there.

sand is in two of my tanks, Never have a problem with the filter getting "jacked"..... Never..... I dont even have a problem vacuuming it, and it is that fine silicon stuff from home depot.

beach by us i find some really nice rock... kinda nano stuff... looks nice as accent pieces.. i can probably swoop some up for ppl if their is interest.. usually the nice looking ones arent big tho.. Ill take a pic of the stuff if i can find it..


Edit.. Here are the pics of the rocks.. These are in a 10 gallon to reference size[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

those are some nice looking rocks dude
whats that white stuff on them??

its some other type of rock.. ive split one over on a rock on the beach and the whole inside was the whitish rock... All i have figured so far is the white rock is harder than the grey and the action of the ocean rubs and wears the grey rock away exposing little spots of the white rock in the center of the rock.. The white spots are raised as well... I like the ones i find with a bunch of tiny white dots.. you can find them with big dots as well.. like the one on the back right and the one on the back left..

my daughter found one like that near fort worden, up by you. the white is probably quartz, pretty hard and the grey is likely some sort of sand stone or something softer. ours was brown with white spots.cool stuff..

yea its nice in a planted tank.. and its just like a regular river rock.. the grey rock is.. i can dind it all over here.. wish i could find something bigger like softball size.. that would be cool...

sandnuka wrote:So, how much sand do I add to a 80gal tank??! Anybody have a good formula for that? I used to believe a pound for every gallon, but its so hard to clean, I was think 1 pound per 2 gallons??? anybody have suggestions?

the best ammount is 1 to .5 lbs per gallon. and the absolute BEST sand to use is Silica Sand. It's the whitest sand and the easiest to maintain water parameters for Africans.

...i kept reading lol I guess you know now. There is also another sand that is *language* to use, it's called Coal Slag, and it's jet black, and about $12/100lbs. it takes a bit more rinsing before using in a tank but the shoot is the bomb and makes some colors pop like fluorescent tubes. which I would reccomend buying if you have none the marine glo and power glo is a supreme mix.

black sand @ 12 bucks for 100lbs! THATS CHEAP! where do I find this sand?!

home depot . it may be a little more like $15 for 100. it's been a while since i've bought any.

Doza wrote:beach by us i find some really nice rock... Edit.. Here are the pics of the rocks.. These are in a 10 gallon to reference size[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

these rocks are super cool and would seriously be an pro eye catching tank if you had black sand.

Does anyone have a pic of the Silica sand bag!? I've gone to Home Depot and Lowes and nobody knows what I'm asking for. They pointed out one bag that they thought might be it,but they werent sure and neither was I.