In the planning process.......

Alright so I have been looking to do an african cichlid tank for a few months now. I have kept so many fish since I was 12 that I don't even know how many speices I have kept. But I have never kept african cichlids. So I am going all out I plan on setting up 1 malawi tank and 1 tang tank. I have the tang tank figured out allready, but the malawi I'm still kinda figuring out. I have been reading on a few types of malawi tank and wanted to know if anyone has experiance keeping Aulonocara baenschi with pseudotropheus acei. I chose a peacock and a mbuna for this tank because I really like the blu and yellow color these fish show. My question is when reading about the p. Acei it says its very docile for a mbuna and can be in a mixed tank without a problem someplaces and others say never mix mbuna with anything eccept mbuna. And when reading on the aulonocara I read its a good fish to keep with any mild mannerd malawi cichlid. So thoughts oh and I want to do 6 (1m 5f) acei, and 1 male aulonocara in a 45 long. Thanks in advance.

Anthony,

Like blue and yellow? Pseudotropheus Saulosi should do you just fine.

Yeah I looked into those and I don't really feel like they are what I am looking for. I really want at least one pecock in the tank. Maybee if I upgrade to a 100+ I woukd consider them but with the smaller tank I really like these two fish and I think that keeping them together would look really good. I feel the kind of soft blue of the acei would really make there yellow fins pop. But not so much that the auloncara would would be outshinned. I kind of like the idea of haveing the subtle acei to make the aulonocara just stand out (focal point of the tank). Does anyone have any experiance with either of these fish? Was. There a suggestion for a diffrent fish because these two would simply not work together? Thanks for the reply.

Anthony,

Acei are one of the few mbuna that I would suggest being compatible with peacocks. You'll want to be pick some of the more aggressive peacocks go to with any mbuna though.

Is that aulonocara baenschi too docile or do you think it would be ok? Also you said one of the few do you have suggestions for othermbuna that would be ok, also do you have suggestions for other peacocks that might work in this set up. Thank you for the reply.

Anthony,

I believe that the Aulonocara jacobfreibergi are a bit more aggressive than the other types of peacocks. A lemon jake would give you the color you are looking for -- the blue and yellow.

You will usually see acei, yellow labs, and rusties being recommended as milder mannered mbuna that can be kept with some of the peacocks. I keep all three of those species and from my experience, the acei seem like the best choice. At least in my tanks, they are the least boisterous of the three species.

Is the 45 gallon at least 4 feet long?

Yes 4 feet.... thank you very much for the informitive post. Lemon jake that's a cool common name I will have to do some reading thank you..... I was considering rusties but the yellow and blue is symbolic so I don't want to stray from the color, but my mom keeps I. Sprengerae with p. Afra "cobue" and saulosi and she says there personality way out shines even the stunning colors of the other two mbuna. She tried to talk me into a rusty only tank. But I don't have enough tanks to be running single species only tanks. Well anyway thanks for the reply.

Anthony,

I wouldn't put a rusty in with Aulonocara... I know they're supposed to be extremely peaceful, but they really seem far more aggressive than something like the acei or yellow lab.

Acei would look great in the tank and definitely have the right temperament to get along with the Aulonocara.

I've got some yellow-tail aceis growing out now, actually, but they're still too small to go in a tank with fish much bigger than them.

Im curious on the tang tank... what you plan on keepin in that bad boy? and whats the size?

Ive kept peacocks with all types of mbuna and really never had a problem... I know people say dont mix them, but I like to experiment for myself before I go out and tell people stuff.... and my conclusion, didnt have a problem. this was a long time ago, before I really got into africans... now I tend to not mix more than 2 or 3 variants in a tank... and always do 1male 3female ratio per variant. If anything they usually beat up the females of there own kind before anything else... itleast thats what I experinced.

I've observed problems mixing mbuna with peacocks but I've not done it firsthand and hence can't give an opinion on the likelihood of success. But I do not that most Aul. don't do well with being chased and nipped at - they react somewhere between getting stressed and not showing their colors well and hanging at the top corners of the tank (and dying if not being removed). To be fair, that's the same reaction some mbuna will have as well.

The acei or yellow lab combination just gives the best chance of being successful, but fish are just like people - some are lovers, and some are fighters, and you often can't tell the difference until it's too late.

Alright thank you guys for the insight and experiances. I really like that lemon jake its cool looking the only thing I don't like about it is that the some have a lot of yellow and some only have a little. But I will probably go with them because that is what was suggested. Although I really like the colors on the baenschi.

The tang tank is only a 29 its actually my in wall tank and I plan on keeping 1 maked julie, 1 black calvus and 1 leupi, I plant to upgrad this tank to a 3' bowfront I think its 46 gallons in a year or so and adding another calvus, a single brichardi and a pair of occies (maybee). I guess I'm still up in the air with it though. I thought about doing just maked julies and leupi, but I really want calvus. Then I hought about a brichardi species tank but I reall want calvus. Both tanks are going to have about 50 percent of thank with rock work.

...but fish are just like people - some are lovers, and some are fighters, and you often can't tell the difference until it's too late

I really agree with that. A combination that works in one tank, might not work in another. There are so many variables.

What I observed in my tank that I tried keeping some peacocks in with labs, rusties and acei was that the mbuna grew much more quickly. They have a more aggressive feeding style -- coming up to the surface and practically jumping out of the tank while the peacocks waited more mid-level in the tank. The peacocks weren't really chased or harassed, they just didn't grow.

I know that a lot of people have success with the mix and have great colored up males, which is why I tried it, but it just didn't work in my tank.

fish-n-vw, There is a chance I have to move to kuwait within the next few months.... which is good and bad... but if i do, I will be sellin my tanks... I have a beautiful 46gallon bowfront, with matching stand, and its set up for tang... currently got 10 tropheus musanga, 5 leulipi, and 5 julis in there.... obviously this isnt suppost to stay this way, but for now it eveyrone is doin good... anyway, if I leave I will let you know, you can have first dibs on the tank.

I'm kinda freaked out about throwing a peacock in, I keep reading online horror stories. I think I'm just gonna go mbuna. I think.... I guess its still up in the air. I really like the afra "cobue" so I'm gonna keep reading about what works with the acei as I want them to be the large population in the tank.

BTW I am getting 4 acei tonight and my mom might ship me some more.... would really rather buy localy but we will see what happens.

From an idea 2 months ago to some fish in a tank. I picked up my 4 acei from my buddy who wanted to go to a tang tank and these were the last of his fish to go. There are 4 and they are between 2 and 3 inches. They are yellow tails. I put them in a 20 long that I was cycling for some shellies (wich I will do when the 45 these guys are going into is clear of the pearsei that are growing out there). I figured since I was able to get these for a pretty good price (4 for $10) and I really like them and they are probably the least aggresive fish I am going to have in the 45 I would start with them. He only had 4 and I was hoping for like 10 so I will be on the lookout for 6 more (I figure that way I can pick out sub dom males and get the male to female ratio right.

Man these fish are active, like I said I have never kept africans before. These are like little crack monkeys swimming all super fast and duckin and dippin and slidin between the rocks and stuff. There only about 15 minutes in and I can already see they are nuts. The don't stop going and there's nothing gracefull about them. They are just fast, crazy psycho fish. I don't know how to sex them and everything I read says its really tough unless you vent and I don't know how to soooooo, I am hoping in time size will give some good insight. Also I hear if you watch them pretty close for a while you can tell from there behavior. As it is now there are three that have egg spots. 1 has a sigle bright egg spot and seems to be dominant (darkest blue and chases everything else). 1 has two bright egg spots (not nearly as dark or chasey). The third has a single very faint egg spot (gets chased) and the fourth has no spot (chased).

I know how much everyone loves pics but I couldent get a clear pic of the fish to save my life (there psycho's). But I did get a pic of the tank with my phone. This is only a grow out and I will add some more structure, when I set the 45 up I am going to make about 40% of the tank rock (we have a landscaping yard close by and I will get some rock from there). Anyway here's the pic, you can see one of the fish kinda chilling out but the other 3 are just a blue and yellow streak.

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Thanks for looking and I will let you know and get some advice when I decide on for sure tankmates. I am kinda thinking 6ish P. Acei (yellow tail) 1m 5f, 4ish afra "cobue" 1m 3f, and 1 or 2 yellow labs. I think this will give me a lot of yellow and a lot of blue. And I think all of the fish are compatible. So let me know what you guys think.

Anthony - white yellow-tail acei's the best way to "guess" the sex (meaning anything short of seeing them hold or venting them once fully matured) is that the male may develop a white leading edge to his dorsal fin that will be prominent when he's courting a female.

Don't bother with the egg-spot method, it's meaningless. I could show you males in my tanks with none and females that have more than my most spotted male.

I love acei's - I have a quad of yellow-tails and 6 F1 white-tails.

Do you think this tank looks suitable for now and would I be ok adding 6 more to this tank?

Looking a little closer at the fish I see two of them have a little white on there tail fin edge one just very slight and the other more pronounced. But I see no white on the dorsal of any.

What do you think of my final stocking idea? I saw your stock list and I was like danggit he's gonna think I'm copying him. But I'm not I think we just have a similar taste in small mbuna. The yellow and blue is for my high school colors (blue and gold) kinda cheesy but I hope my kids go there, and the tank is in there room and those are just the most attractive I have seen in my research that are not super spendy or super hard to find.

I keep seeing one fish shimmer at the others it dosent seem to descriminate wich it is shimmering too. Is this courting? Should I be looking for the white in the dorsal then?

These are really cool fish, I feel like they need some medication for hyper activity, but they are a real joy to watch none the less.

That combination (6 acei's, 4 cobues, 1-2 yellow labs) will work just fine. What's the footprint of your 45g? To be honest, the acei's will get fairly large (about 6") and really need a 48" tank. The cobues and labs would be okay in a 36" tank.

In that tank the cobue male will be the tank boss most likely. If you only get 1-2 labs I would say stick with females only on them. I haven't observed any fighting between my larger acei group (also 6 - 3m:3f) to this point and they're all actively spawning (Laura just pointed out that all 3 females are now holding though - who wants F2 white-tail acei's in 3-4 months? LOL).

I don't worry about people copying me - I'm not all that original anyway! - heck, my stocking list is a nightmare, but it works (most of the time). Pick what you like and go from there. If you're like me you'll end up wanting to vary this over time anyway.

I love my mbuna and don't expect I'll ever have tanks and not at least one be full of them.

That's cool that they should be good together. Its a 45 long which is a 55 gallon just a few inches shorter. So yeah 48 inches. I almost wish I was setting up another tank so I could take you up on those white tails. If you don't mind me asking what's the stock list in your 55? You can pm it if you want. I see in your sig. What you have but not how many. I'm just curious if I am going heavy or light for the typical mbuna aquarium. Thanks for the help man I am very gratefull.

fish-n-vw, I love the tank... I like how simple it is with lots of open space... this will keep them from all hiding and make it more of an active tank..... which you already see, ("crack head fish"). They will actually get a little more graceful once they get used to there new home... they will do the hole, pause... dart.... pause... dart... kinda thing... very cool. Africans are by far my favorite fish to watch. So entertaining!

The stock list looks perfect... Im just imagining the colors... will be a gorgeous african community tank.... and I honestly dont think you should have much cross breedin because the colors are so different between them. Only thing I would suggest, I know you dont want to, but I think a red ruby peacock would just put the whole thing together.

I don't think you're going too heavy. My mbuna tanks almost look like cans of sardines.

I have plenty of filtration and do 50% water changes every week and have no problems with overstocking.

Oh I'll bet the 45 will be nice then. The upper range of the tank is complete lost on mbuna anyway.

I don't mind sharing the details on my tanks. Here's my 55g malawai stocking:

12 Ps. demasoni - I don't bother to sex these, ratio doesn't matter
4 (1M:3f) Cyno. afra "cobue"
6 (2M:4F) Lab. caeruleus
6 (3M:3F - will be adjusting this) I. sprengerae
6 (2M:4F) Ps. acei "white tail"
2 (1M:1F) Ancistrus plecostomus
1 Mastacembelus shiranus - I haven't found a way to sex this yet

You have to note, however, that this tank won't compare to any tank that isn't housing demasoni. They are so unlike other mbuna that you basically have to plan a tank around them. They are small, require relatively little space (for a mbuna), but show high con-specific aggression.

Yes, I am way, way overstocked. My cobues and acei's are still small. And they acei's won't reach maturity in that tank; I'll cycle them out into my 125g and put some juvie yellow-tails in their place.

I run a Fluval 405 canister on the tank with the intake and return both low in the tank, and have a powerhead at the top to break the water tension. There is roughly 120lbs of lace rock in the tank, with some fake plants, black sand and LED lighting. I run dual 100w heaters in there as well.

We do 50% water changes every 5-7 days, and use prime to dechlorinate and cichlids salts to maintain the water chemistry.

That's everything I can think of.

After just under an hour and 172 pictures this is the best pic I could get of one of them.... you have to look clos because if I got the phone anywhere neer the tank they would go ape.

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Btw they have seemed to calm down a bit. But there still crack monkeys I really like them. There like me full of energy and just doin what they do.

:: jees I spell like a preschooler when I'm tierd.::

Wow that was thorough for a stocklist. Thanks for all the help. And thank you betty and everyone else who has helped me to plan this out. I will probably have more questions and maybee change the stock list down the road but for now its 4 psycho yellow tail acei, will probably double it in a few weeks and go from there. Now to get the 180 set up for my pearsei.

fish_n_vw wrote:After just under an hour and 172 pictures this is the best pic I could get of one of them.... you have to look clos because if I got the phone anywhere neer the tank they would go ape.

Btw they have seemed to calm down a bit. But there still crack monkeys I really like them. There like me full of energy and just doin what they do.

ROFL!! Don't worry, they'll calm down a lot. Your labs and cobues will be the crack monkeys once the tank gets into its groove - the acei's should settle down quite a bit. Mine like to come up to me when I'm trying to photograph the tank and stick their nose in the camera.